Ep #9: How to Deal with a Difficult Ex

I'm Mikki Gardner, and this is the Co-Parenting with Confidence podcast, episode number 9, How to Deal with a Difficult Ex. Welcome to Co-Parenting with Confidence, a podcast for those courageous moms out there who want to move past the conflict and frustration of divorce and show up as the mom they truly want to be. My name's Mikki Gardner. I am a certified life and conscience parenting coach with my own personal dose of co-parenting experience. Throughout my co-parenting journey, I have learned to be confident in who I am as a woman and a mother, and I am here to help you do the same. If you are ready to learn what it takes to become a great co-parent and an amazing example to your children. Well, get ready, and let's dive into today's episode. Welcome back, friend. I am so happy to be here with you and to be talking about this topic. Today we're going to talk all about conflict. And how to deal with a difficult ex. Listen, I know that after divorce, well, shoot, before divorce, there's usually a lot of conflicts. There might be fighting. There might be all kinds of things going on, but there's definitely conflict. And when we get to the point of the divorce, we haven't necessarily resolved it. But what many of us have done is created an entire story around conflict. What it means, and what happens next. You know I will just be really honest here, that for me, when I couldn't resolve the conflict of my marriage, I just made the assumption that I am not good with conflict, that I'm not able to resolve things. That this just isn't something that I can do. That started to show up all over my life, and I started to see the problems with this thinking. I don't know if you can relate to that at all. Feeling like if I was better at figuring this out, you know, I would still be married. Or, you know, he is just too difficult, and so we were never going to get anywhere. You know all of these kinds of all-or-nothing things happen. This thinking happens often when we experience divorce. But that's why I want to talk about it today because, in actuality, conflict is a very normal and necessary part of human relationships. The problem isn't the conflict that's happening. It's that we believe it shouldn't be happening. So, what I want to talk about today is kind of normalizing conflict and understanding what's going on. So, when conflict happens, this is, I just finished Jayson Gaddis' book, it's called, Getting To Zero. It's a really awesome book. That is all about conflict and how to resolve conflicts in your high-stakes relationships. But what I really like is, he broke down what conflict actually is. Right? When we are connected with someone, when we are experiencing, especially high-stake relationship where we are very connected to them, and then conflict happens, we disconnect. The next step after disconnection is to reconnect, right? So, there's connection, disconnection, and then we want to reconnect. Well, this reconnect part is kind of what happens in divorce when we are not able to reconnect. When it's severed, when the relationship ends, so to speak, and that's when we start to feel that we just aren't good with conflict. That's why I wanted so much to talk about it today. You know, and it can be really hard. I understand with a difficult ex, who doesn't want to reconnect, who doesn't want connection, who doesn't want to talk at all, right? They just want to be left alone, and they just want to avoid, they just want their way, maybe they use intimidation and other tactics to get it. But here's the thing, when we avoid conflict, either because we are people-pleasing, or we don't want to get into a fight with somebody. When we are avoiding conflict on the outside with another person, we are creating inner conflict in ourselves. So, how many times does this happen to you where maybe your ex does something, and you're like, oh, I can't believe he is doing that again. I knew he was going to do that. Then you start to think, get into the think spiral of, what do I do? What's the right thing? What's the thing that he won't get upset about? What's the thing that's going to be the least painful for me in this, right? And we start ruminating and start in these spirals. But really, all we are doing is creating conflict within ourselves by avoiding what's happening outside. So, Jayson teaches in this book, and I have certainly learned from so many teachers, but I do like the way that he describes it. Is it, you know, we have a relational blueprint. It's an understanding of how conflict happens, how it works, and what our part is in it. And we learn this at a very young age. So, when we feel safe as children, we can be ourselves. When we feel unsafe, we're led to act differently. He calls this his strategic self. This is the self that we put on to avoid confrontation. So, it's the gap between who we truly are and this sort of persona, this strategic self that we have built to avoid conflict and avoid disconnection. That this is what creates the tension in the inner conflict for us because this is what makes us feel kind of off when we're not being true to ourselves, this shows up as people-pleasing. What is that? It's doing things for other people so that they're comfortable. So that they feel okay, right? We people please to try to control other people's emotions, and ultimately to make ourselves feel better. So, the reason I bring this up is it's really important to understand what is our relational blueprint because the way that we saw conflict and learned to deal with it, either by creating a persona, is how we are dealing with it now. So, this relational blueprint that we learned how to deal or not deal with conflict is determining what is happening in our lives today. And it determines the sort of attachment style that we get. I am sure some of you have heard about that, and we will get into that in other episodes. But as kids, we see how the big people in our lives demonstrate conflict. Right, is there nothing wrong with conflict? Is it normal? Do they show us how to reconnect or not? But typically, people fall into one of four categories that they use to cope with conflict. So, one of them is posturing. This is where the person puffs up. They become very large, and they become very sort of aggressive. Maybe this might be the way that your ex dealt with things, right? Just sort of going in guns a blazing, and we're going to figure this out. The other coping style, the second one, is to collapse or to get small. This might be, almost think of like, a hermit crab where we just immediately retreat back. We get really small and go within our shells. This might be where we blame ourselves, maybe we're blaming others, but we're just getting very small and not really doing anything, but we are hiding. The third coping style is called seeking, right? And this is invasive, like, need to fix. This might show up if you're one of those people who are like, I can't sleep until we resolve this, right, and you go towards it, really wanting to figure out how to fix it, change it, get it done. The fourth coping style is to avoid, right? This is where you just get distant. This might show up if you are a person who is like, if we can't resolve this, I am just out. It's always I am done. I am gone. So, these are the four coping strategies that most people fall into. Again it's posturing, or puffing up, collapsing, or getting very small, seeking, seeking to invade or to fix something, and then the fourth is to avoid, just get distance, and leave. This is really important to understand because what your relational blueprint is, what your tendency is, is typically how you are going to show up in conflict today. And so, when we start to become aware of what we do and how we do it. Then we have more power to change it because we can understand what's truly going on. So, one thing that I really love from Jayson's book is this idea of most times, we actually only leave ourselves two choices when conflict happens. But this isn't an accurate reflection of what's really going on. I know before we have talked about flexible thinking, and this is going to come in here. This is where we start to become really aware, conscious of what's happening. That's why I started with the relational blueprint. So that we can understand what do I typically do in these settings? Then, we're going to start to get curious around what we're doing because curiosity is what's going to keep us out of just two shitty choices and find other choices. So what are these two choices that he speaks of? So, typically we will give ourselves one of two choices when we are in conflict. We can either A, speak up, but this often comes with a fear of retaliation, of conflict, of losing the relationship, of you know, time and energy wasted. This goes into the worst-case scenario. So, this might look like a fear of speaking up for fear of retaliation. Maybe you think if I say something, my ex isn't going to agree with me, and then he is going to do it anyway, and I am going to be alienated on my own. Or if I push too hard, he is going to try to get full custody, and I am going to lose my kids, and it goes into worst-case scenario. Can you relate to this one at all? I know I have been there. The second choice that he offers the idea of is that we say nothing, right? We just maintain the status quo. We fear that nothing will ever change, and we're going to be stuck in this conflict forever. That we're going to be sad and alone, it's just more of what we're already getting. This is where that strategic self comes in. Whatever that typical response is, whatever we've learned to do, you know, some of us have learned to be just really good girls. Do all the things for all the people so that they like us. This is where this comes in. But that strategic self is not authentic to us. This is where conflict comes in. This is where the tension comes in. This is where we just feel off, and we don't feel good, right? We can say nothing. We can maintain the status quo, but we continue being miserable. I know for me, a lot of times when conflict comes up, I will just go to avoid it. I figure out what I can do to change to get around it to make people feel more comfortable. I definitely step into that people-pleasing role. But what it does, it doesn't honor what's going on for me. I'm not saying what's wrong. I am not saying what I think. I am not standing up for what I believe is right, right? I am just staying in the status quo and ultimately feeling more and more miserable. So, can you see that how, when we only offer ourselves these two choices, we are stuck, right? And when we stay in that, not understanding that there is a third choice. This is where we prolong conflict for quite a long time. So, what Jayson offers and what I want to offer here is that there is a third choice, and that starts by understanding what's really going on here. What we have to understand is that choice B, that I think of so many of take. That just say nothing, maintaining the status quo out of fear of nothing changing. This is really just betraying ourselves, right? Because we are disconnecting from ourselves, maybe we're people-pleasing, but we're not changing anything. We're not resolving the conflict at hand. So, instead, what we have to start to understand is that choice A, is actually our authentic choice. That's speaking up. Yes, we are afraid to do it. Yes, we're afraid of the conflict. Yes, that goes into all of those worst-case scenarios thinking. But when we start to understand that it is our need to speak up because we need to embrace our true self to honor what's true for us, and embrace the conflict, and tell ourselves the truth about what's going on, and be willing to be uncomfortable. Be willing to stand up for what you truly want. Choice C, or this third choice, is really all about deciding. And we have talked about this before. It's deciding to address the conflict, to allow yourself to be uncomfortable. The issue really isn't the difficult people. Listen, we're all difficult as humans, me too, you too, right? That's just part of being human. The issue is the uncomfortable stuff that those people bring up in us. We feel like we don't know how to handle it. And when we've been divorced, we use all of our conflict in the marriage as evidence that we don't know how to deal with it. But this isn't true. Right? Instead, we have to stop trying to get the other person to change, and we need to focus on what we can change, and that's us, that's you. Right? We have to start to understand what feelings is this person bringing up or triggering in me that's my responsibility to deal with? We need to start to increase our emotional discomfort threshold. What is that? It's being willing to be uncomfortable. It's being willing to learn to get a little bit more comfortable with being uncomfortable. How do we do this? Well, we need to learn to be with ourselves. It's called self-regulation. To manage ourselves, to soothe ourselves, to let ourselves be seen and heard, right? That's really all people want, all humans. They want to be seen, heard, soothed, and celebrated. So, when we understand that those are anybody's relational needs, ours, our exes, our children, right, we have to start to do that for ourselves. So, we can connect to it for others. So, self-regulating or being with the emotional discomfort, especially when we have to speak up, and then when we have this point where we understand that we need to speak up in order to resolve the conflict, we have to self-reflect. That's seeing clearly and accepting what needs to be changed—but accepting it for ourselves first and understanding clearly what's happening. We can ask ourselves this question, what am I scared of right now? And let yourself answer it like five layers deep. What do I mean by that? What am I afraid of? Okay, if I'm afraid to speak up because of conflict, why am I afraid of that conflict? Well, I'm afraid that he's going to get angry. Why am I afraid that he is going to get angry? Because when he gets angry, I feel small and helpless. Okay, why is it a problem when I feel small and helpless? Because I don't know what to do, and then I end up getting run over, and I act like a doormat. Do you see how if you keep asking yourself the question, you keep going a little bit deeper and deeper? That's when we start to understand what we're truly afraid of. When we understand what we're truly afraid of, that gives us the power to understand what we can do about it. We can start to understand how we can change ourselves within the context of the situation. And I'm not saying change ourselves to manipulate the situation or to change ourselves to make things go away. No, I'm talking about being willing to stand up to speak up for ourselves, to say what is true for us. Even if it doesn't change exactly how we want it to, sometimes, conflict doesn't resolve itself in a neat little package. But we have to be willing to try. We have to be willing to speak up. Otherwise, we're just staying in that self-betrayal of not saying anything, of maintaining the status quo, and adding more and more frustration to ourselves. This is all about learning to be with yourself, to survive conflict, to allow others to be who they are without betraying ourselves as a way to feel more comfortable. So, now that we understand conflict a little better, what's going on, and that we don't just have two choices, but we have other choices. We have that third option of learning to stand up for ourselves, to speak our truth, and to do it from a way of taking care of ourselves. So, how does this start to look in real life? So, I am going to talk about three ways that we can actually start to implement that third choice. That choice is where we tell ourselves the truth. We speak up for ourselves, and we do it in a way that honors and protects us. So, the first way that I want to talk about is we have to decide if it's even a fight worth fighting, and what do I mean? One of my favorite quotes that I've heard is that you are not required to attend every fight you're invited to. And I love this. I think of this so often. When someone comes at me with sort of this big drama, I get to decide if I'm going to engage or not. So, the first one is really deciding, am I going to engage in this? Is this a fight worth fighting for me? How do we do that? We ask ourselves a series of three questions, one, how serious is it really? So, the next time somebody comes at you with all of this stuff, or you feel the conflict building, ask yourself how serious is this really? Short of physical safety, not much is like, really imperative and important and has to be dealt with that moment. So, if it's not super serious that I have to deal with it right this second, like physical safety, I ask myself the second question. What is essential here? If it's a commitment that I made or if it's something revolving the kids or showing up for them, you know, I might need to be honest. What's essential is just stating what I need to do or what needs to happen and showing up. That doesn't mean that I have to do it perfectly. But it just means that I have to do what's essential. The last question is, what is the next most loving action I can take? When we are in conflict, when things get really big, we start to see all of the things that we can or can't do. So, instead, we just need to break it down to the next step. What is the next most loving action? When I say that, I don't mean loving like puppies and rainbows and giving in to whatever somebody wants. What I mean is really starting to understand what's the most loving thing to do? Sometimes, the most loving thing to do is say no, or I'm not going to engage in this. We can discuss this later when everyone's calm. Sometimes that's the most loving thing to do, to protect yourself and others. So, that's the first one, decide if it's a fight worth fighting. The second tool that we can use to start to address and understand conflict is to decide between is this something that we want to have happen or is this something that we need to have happen? The need is those things that are non-negotiable that we are not willing to not change versus something that we would really like to change. We need to be really clear with ourselves. Is this a non-negotiable, or is this a desire? We have to understand and approach people with reasonable requests. When we demand, when we go in like a bull in a China shop, oftentimes, we don't get the result that we want. We're coming at someone in a way that doesn't promote conflict resolution. Instead, it provides more conflict. So, we need to decide whether this is a non-negotiable. Is this a hard line? There are non-negotiables, 100%, right, physical violence, emotional abuse, for you there might be different things that you just will not tolerate, maybe you know, complete messes in the house, maybe being late all the time, whatever it is for you, you get to decide it, nobody else. But we decide what is negotiable vs. not negotiable. Then we start to understand that when we want to resolve a conflict, we need to make it about that need—that non-negotiable or negotiable, or the thing that we just want. But we make it about the behavior. We make it about that thing vs. the person, about who they are. When we make it about the behavior and not the person, we take a lot of the drama out of it. We de-escalate it because when we make it about the person, it becomes a personal attack. There's judgment, there's blaming, and this puts us more into conflict rather than resolving. When we make it about the action, we are stepping back, and we're allowing ourselves to show up in a different way. So, the third of the three ways that I want to talk about is five agreements. And these are ways we're going to ease the discomfort of conflict. So, we all get emotional and reactive. That's just part of life, right? It happens. But what we want to do is create parameters that help us relax, right. That we have a clear agreement with ourselves and maybe even the other person that helps guide us when conflict arises. Because many times we just feel so helpless. So, what we want to do is start to give ourselves the parameters that we can use to ease into the discomfort. So, the first of these is to make clear agreements. These are made to assist us in conflict. So, think about an area that you typically have misunderstanding or conflict around with your ex. Maybe it's about how to sign kids up for activities or what things they're going to go to. Then you create a clear agreement. Maybe you say something like, unless we both say yes to an activity that the kids want to do, then we have 36 hours to resolve it together. If we can't resolve it, discuss it, and agree, then we both share the cost for the mediator or a third party to come in and help us resolve it. So, this is a clear agreement because it says very clearly what's going to happen. We have a time limit of when we will resolve it. How we're going to resolve it, and then if we don't, what the consequence of that is. And it's a shared consequence. Sometimes people are just unwilling to do it. Maybe your ex is like, and I'm not doing any of that. Well, then you can go to the next step. You can decide what you're going to do when they won't. But by being very clear, you're stating what you're going to do, and then you're holding to that. Over time that creates more confidence for you, and the other person starts to understand that you're not going to waver; that you're going to be very clear in your agreements and hold to that. The second thing is to say to yourself. I agree to learn to embrace conflict is normal without using blame. When we understand that conflict is normal and it's actually an opportunity to grow, we're more willing to step into it. If you're willing to use it as an opportunity to see what triggers you and then work on that, this is a place of empowerment. This makes conflict almost useful. This is the part that is normal and necessary in relationships. It's taking ownership over your part. This leads us to the third agreement. I agree to own my part. This looks like taking responsibility for your actions. Ownership keeps the power with you. You have the power to change your behavior and your actions to listen and to speak in a way that supports you and everyone else. People think that owning our part is about giving away our power, but it's quite the opposite. When we understand our responsibility, and we take responsibility for it and show up, we are coming from a much stronger, more empowered place. The fourth agreement is to say. I agree to speak with care and respect. Listen, when we're triggered, or we're in fear, our little animal primitive brain takes over. We don't show up as our best selves. We're just in survival mode at that point. We might attack back, retaliate, say that nasty thing that we know will hurt them, but long term, this isn't in our best interest. This isn't resolving conflict. This is creating more. If you truly care about you and your family, you have to get very clear and on the other side of conflict. So, we have to learn to communicate in a way that we can listen and that we can be heard. This is about just being a decent human without backstabbing or yelling or screaming, or speaking in a way that scares the other person. You know, it's not using sarcasm or making fun of them. But it's taking, again, responsibility for you, using I statements, and speaking with care and respect. I understand that sometimes your ex may not be talking in a caring and respectful way, but that doesn't mean that you going to their level is going to help anything, right. That actually just prolongs and increases the conflict. Sometimes we just have to decide I am going to speak with care and respect because that's actually in my best interest and how I feel best. The fifth agreement is that I agree not to bring up big conflict over text or email and to find the right moment. You know this is a personal rule for me across the board in my relationships, that I will not fight over text or email. Face-to-face communication is just more effective. Too much gets left out when we're writing in a text. If you look at the world today, it's really easy to blame somebody. It's really easy to cut somebody down when you don't have to look at them. That's why cyberbullying and things happen because we disconnect when it's a phone or a screen, and it's not the person in front of us. So, to stay true in our relationships, we have to be willing to resolve these things, to find a way. And so, we have to find the right moment. We have to be willing to sit with the discomfort to find the time when we can actually communicate. This might take a little bit. I understand that. When we refuse to take the bait, when we refuse to fight over text or email, and we actually say this is way too important to me to continue in this manner, and I want to set up a time that we can talk through this. Either on the phone or with a mediator or in person, whatever it is, it actually shows the care and respect for the relationship to resolve it for the betterment of the relationship. And this is what this is all about, is learning how to work through the conflict, how to deal with a difficult ex, how to stay true to yourself, and show up for you so, that you have more confidence in your co-parenting going forward. So, I hope this show is helpful for you today, and it gave you some ideas of how to think about and how to manage conflict in a different way. Conflict is a normal part of life with other humans. But the better we get at reconnecting, the stronger and healthier our relationships are. Trust me. If I had that magic wand that would change all the people in your life and make the conflict go away, I would gladly give it to you. It just doesn't exist. But what does exist is your ability to show up, as the woman, as the mom, and the human that you want to be. But we have to do that by understanding, by regulating ourselves, being able to be with ourselves when we're uncomfortable, be willing to reflect and understand what's happening and then start to make choices from there. So, thank you so much for being with me. If you've enjoyed this conversation, I would be so grateful if you would share it? You could just take a screenshot and share it on Instagram, and tag me, and I will share it with tons of love. And if you haven't already, I would really appreciate it if you would leave a rating and a review for the show, and let me know what you think about it. Because it helps other people find the show and helps us spread the word. Listen, it doesn't have to be a five-star rating, although I sure would love that. I just want your honest feedback so that I can create an awesome podcast that provides a ton of value for you. As always, if you want to hear about any of my free, upcoming workshops that I host or ways to work with me, just go to www.mikkigardner.com to sign up for my newsletter so that you're in the know about all of those things. So, that's what I've got for you. I will see you next week, and in the meantime, take good care of you, and tons of love, my friend. Thanks for listening to Co-Parenting with Confidence. If you want more information or resources from this podcast, visit CoParentingwithConfidence.com. I'll see you next week.